With all due respect, history is conveniently used to make people say and do all kinds of things. Even atheists have an internal moral compass. Anyone who looks inward can see the grievous wrongdoings of this administration and their followers. They have to be willing to use that moral compass built into us human beings.
The fundamentalist mindset is not just in Christianity - it is also evident in other religions also and we witness that in many of the immigrants we welcome into the west. Enough of the numerous dogmas and creeds. We just need to learn to be kind to each other
I'm not a "Deconstructed Christian" because I was never a Christian at all. Raised just outside of San Francisco by Northern California intellectual parents, Church just wasn't a thing.
BUT I'm a junkie for history (don't EVEN get me started on the injustice of lionizing Jefferson and castigating Adams and if you bring up how Aaron Burr was treated in that "Historical Musical" we might have to throw down). Living in the West, you can't really understand American and European history without a thorough understanding of the history of Christianity and the Bible. They provide the context of the last 2,000 years.
Though I wasn't raised "Christian", I'm probably more familiar with the Christian Bible than most, having read the Catholic, King James, Eastern Orthodox (in translation) and the Evangelical Good News Bibles. In addition, I've also read recommended translations of the Torah, Talmud, Q'oran and the archeologically recovered Dead Sea Scrolls & The Gnostic Gospels (the last two to get a better understanding of one of the most pivotal and manipulative events in western history, the Council of Niceae).
There's a lot of good in all of the scriptures, good lessons and good pathways to lead a kind and ethical/moral life. It's just too bad that these Nationalist so-called "Christians" ignore anything that's inconvenient for their preferred (and delusional) narrative. Here in the US, they treat our Constitution in the same shabby manner.
My younger brother went down the Jesus Road (as the Navajo/Diné say) a few years ago and the results have been devastating within our family. He's become more and more radicalized, embracing the current President, anti-vaxx, tons of guns (and absolutely no training), Qanon, moving first to Florida and just a week or so ago to Kentucky. My parents both passed away within the last few years (Mom in 2019 and Dad in 2023) and they both passed away horrified and heart broken about what my brother had become. They wondered where they had gone so horribly wrong in bringing him up.
On the bright side, I get to correct his Biblical misquotes on a very regular basis...
I was raised in fundamentalist Baptist churches (General Association of Regular Baptist Churches) as a child. Social justice was never preached, and the only prophetic text used was Revelation to assure us that trouble in the Middle East meant Jesus would be returning any day and we would burn in hell if we weren’t “right with God.” They used Isaiah and a few other places for Christmas and Easter to show Jesus fulfilled prophecy, but the rest of the books were mostly ignored.
When I ended up only finding Southern Baptist churches when I moved to Missouri, the teaching was much more radical (but I had actually been kind of absent from church for almost two years). I am not sure how long it had been that way, but from the pulpit and in Bible studies they were advocating for changing US law to the OT law (because “God created us and knows the laws that would serve us best”), the end of voting rights for women, and the social safety net being turned to block grants given to churches to administer. On the OT law, the deacon who preached that sermon observed that adolescent rebellion would end quickly after the first few stonings, and I don’t remember who was preaching the safety net one, but they gleefully discussed being able to control sinners by withholding money to anyone “in sin,” and how much church attendance would skyrocket because people would believe churches they attended would be more willing to help them. 🤦♀️
That church absolutely horrified me, though there were a few very sweet decent people in it. I am not sure how they felt about some of these teachings.
It took a Sunday School at my husband’s church reading word for word through prophecy (which by this time I was afraid to read because it was twisted so badly out of context in sermons my whole life I believed it was not understandable) for me to finally hear God’s definition of justice. It was life-changing.
Not to alarm you too much by this but : God is your ego, tricked around on you by a con man. That way you fight for it instead of against it since it’s the oppressor.
"Every Sunday school is a kind of Inquisition where they torture and deform the minds of children..."
-Robert G Ingersoll
Also,
In 1845, the Southern Baptists separated from the Triennial Convention in order to support slavery, which the southern churches regarded as "an institution of heaven"
The Southern Baptist church was definitely a trip. All of them, though, were definitely fundamentalist, really heavy on patriarchy. My sons’ father (my ex - people get confused; I am a widow, but my ex still lives) was abusive. Per their very strict reading, I had no right to divorce for abuse; it was suggested that I try to be a better wife so he wouldn’t have to punish me so often. However, I could leave him for adultery, but even there they added a caveat: it had to be unrepentant adultery. If he said he was going to try to save our marriage, regardless of what happened before, I had to counsel and stay, because “divorce makes Jesus cry.” 🤦♀️
Since he was an abusive jerk who knew the positions of my church, he would tell me I had no proof of adultery until the day I did. Then he demanded marriage counseling. I said fine, as long as he got rid of the girlfriends (yes, plural). He replied he had to keep them in case counseling didn’t work out.
I STILL got condemned by the SBC: I was “committing adultery by proxy” for “allowing him to have affairs.” I guess I finally had had it with them. I suggested they take the OT law they loved so much, take my ex and his girlfriend (the 18-year-old he fell in love with) to the edge of town and stone them because then I would be a virtuous widow and there would be no condemnation they could use on me.
Dang. That’s quite a story but makes sense within context. Sounds even familiar from other stories I’ve heard of groups like the Amish.
Sheesh, congrats on getting closure on that chapter & moving on. It’s a scapegoat religion & women often take that irrational brunt & minorities of course.
The clergymen always like to toy with libidos too - as if they should have any say - smh. Brainwashing bastards. I’d steer your kid as clear of the pervert mess as you can if possible. Some areas make it more difficult than others.
Very well presented. A wise Pastor once told us to read everything in the Bible ‘ in context ‘. Read the preceding chapter/ verses to establish the background history and geological history before you start a discussion. I no longer join groups for bible study, I cannot deal with the hate and conceit. It’s useless to try and have a discussion with so-called‘Christian’s’ .
If Trump actually read the Bible, he would love the phrase "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's" (Matthew (22:21), Mark (12:17), and Luke (20:25). Because he sees himself as Caesar.
If you would like Sharon, after I recover from having written this one, I can cover those , and provide contextually why it is that Christian nationalists often ignore them and/or use other areas of the text to invalidate them.
Go for their jugulars, Wendy! Most of the Christo-nationalists I've encountered, directly or via media, are too damned stupid and ignorant to pass a second-grade reading comprehension test.
With all due respect, history is conveniently used to make people say and do all kinds of things. Even atheists have an internal moral compass. Anyone who looks inward can see the grievous wrongdoings of this administration and their followers. They have to be willing to use that moral compass built into us human beings.
They ignore it
Wendy, DJT is a man who has sold his soul in exchange for money & power.
He is straight up evil and surrounds himself with the same.
It will not end well for any of these cruel bastards, you can bet on that.
Full stop
🤣🤣🤣 I don’t even associate with christian nationalists, much less make friends with them.
Neither do I, but as I have found, you might be FACED with them, and if you are, Id prefer you be prepared.
No, that’s totally fair.
My preferred method is a hearty “fuck off!” 🤣 And if they’re actual fascists/nazis then a fist to the face is always best. 😅
The fundamentalist mindset is not just in Christianity - it is also evident in other religions also and we witness that in many of the immigrants we welcome into the west. Enough of the numerous dogmas and creeds. We just need to learn to be kind to each other
“We are not with Thee, but with him, and that is our secret! For centuries have we abandoned Thee to follow him.” Dostoevsky, Brothers Karamazov
You've got this nailed.
Wrong on both counts!
Far from it. A proud atheist.
Still waiting for an answer....I assume you are a Christian.
Why ?
It is long past time we offer amnesty to the undocumented in our country. Reagan did it in the 80s, we could do it today.
Agreed
I'm not a "Deconstructed Christian" because I was never a Christian at all. Raised just outside of San Francisco by Northern California intellectual parents, Church just wasn't a thing.
BUT I'm a junkie for history (don't EVEN get me started on the injustice of lionizing Jefferson and castigating Adams and if you bring up how Aaron Burr was treated in that "Historical Musical" we might have to throw down). Living in the West, you can't really understand American and European history without a thorough understanding of the history of Christianity and the Bible. They provide the context of the last 2,000 years.
Though I wasn't raised "Christian", I'm probably more familiar with the Christian Bible than most, having read the Catholic, King James, Eastern Orthodox (in translation) and the Evangelical Good News Bibles. In addition, I've also read recommended translations of the Torah, Talmud, Q'oran and the archeologically recovered Dead Sea Scrolls & The Gnostic Gospels (the last two to get a better understanding of one of the most pivotal and manipulative events in western history, the Council of Niceae).
There's a lot of good in all of the scriptures, good lessons and good pathways to lead a kind and ethical/moral life. It's just too bad that these Nationalist so-called "Christians" ignore anything that's inconvenient for their preferred (and delusional) narrative. Here in the US, they treat our Constitution in the same shabby manner.
My younger brother went down the Jesus Road (as the Navajo/Diné say) a few years ago and the results have been devastating within our family. He's become more and more radicalized, embracing the current President, anti-vaxx, tons of guns (and absolutely no training), Qanon, moving first to Florida and just a week or so ago to Kentucky. My parents both passed away within the last few years (Mom in 2019 and Dad in 2023) and they both passed away horrified and heart broken about what my brother had become. They wondered where they had gone so horribly wrong in bringing him up.
On the bright side, I get to correct his Biblical misquotes on a very regular basis...
If authority is ordained by God, shouldn’t the Israelites have just learned to accept their fates as Egyptian slaves?
Jesus works the fields, Trump grifts the cult…..
I was raised in fundamentalist Baptist churches (General Association of Regular Baptist Churches) as a child. Social justice was never preached, and the only prophetic text used was Revelation to assure us that trouble in the Middle East meant Jesus would be returning any day and we would burn in hell if we weren’t “right with God.” They used Isaiah and a few other places for Christmas and Easter to show Jesus fulfilled prophecy, but the rest of the books were mostly ignored.
When I ended up only finding Southern Baptist churches when I moved to Missouri, the teaching was much more radical (but I had actually been kind of absent from church for almost two years). I am not sure how long it had been that way, but from the pulpit and in Bible studies they were advocating for changing US law to the OT law (because “God created us and knows the laws that would serve us best”), the end of voting rights for women, and the social safety net being turned to block grants given to churches to administer. On the OT law, the deacon who preached that sermon observed that adolescent rebellion would end quickly after the first few stonings, and I don’t remember who was preaching the safety net one, but they gleefully discussed being able to control sinners by withholding money to anyone “in sin,” and how much church attendance would skyrocket because people would believe churches they attended would be more willing to help them. 🤦♀️
That church absolutely horrified me, though there were a few very sweet decent people in it. I am not sure how they felt about some of these teachings.
It took a Sunday School at my husband’s church reading word for word through prophecy (which by this time I was afraid to read because it was twisted so badly out of context in sermons my whole life I believed it was not understandable) for me to finally hear God’s definition of justice. It was life-changing.
Sorry to hear you were brainwashed by the fuckers.
It’s okay. I know exactly who they are. It prepared me for the moment. Thank you though. ❤️
Appreciate the levity. 🤙
Not to alarm you too much by this but : God is your ego, tricked around on you by a con man. That way you fight for it instead of against it since it’s the oppressor.
"Every Sunday school is a kind of Inquisition where they torture and deform the minds of children..."
-Robert G Ingersoll
Also,
In 1845, the Southern Baptists separated from the Triennial Convention in order to support slavery, which the southern churches regarded as "an institution of heaven"
I don’t trust clergy,
I trust that they’re enslaving con men
who will tell any lie in order to trip you up.
The Southern Baptist church was definitely a trip. All of them, though, were definitely fundamentalist, really heavy on patriarchy. My sons’ father (my ex - people get confused; I am a widow, but my ex still lives) was abusive. Per their very strict reading, I had no right to divorce for abuse; it was suggested that I try to be a better wife so he wouldn’t have to punish me so often. However, I could leave him for adultery, but even there they added a caveat: it had to be unrepentant adultery. If he said he was going to try to save our marriage, regardless of what happened before, I had to counsel and stay, because “divorce makes Jesus cry.” 🤦♀️
Since he was an abusive jerk who knew the positions of my church, he would tell me I had no proof of adultery until the day I did. Then he demanded marriage counseling. I said fine, as long as he got rid of the girlfriends (yes, plural). He replied he had to keep them in case counseling didn’t work out.
I STILL got condemned by the SBC: I was “committing adultery by proxy” for “allowing him to have affairs.” I guess I finally had had it with them. I suggested they take the OT law they loved so much, take my ex and his girlfriend (the 18-year-old he fell in love with) to the edge of town and stone them because then I would be a virtuous widow and there would be no condemnation they could use on me.
That shocked them for some reason. 😂
Dang. That’s quite a story but makes sense within context. Sounds even familiar from other stories I’ve heard of groups like the Amish.
Sheesh, congrats on getting closure on that chapter & moving on. It’s a scapegoat religion & women often take that irrational brunt & minorities of course.
The clergymen always like to toy with libidos too - as if they should have any say - smh. Brainwashing bastards. I’d steer your kid as clear of the pervert mess as you can if possible. Some areas make it more difficult than others.
Best to you in your fight. 💪
& yeah, reasoning isn’t their strong suit.
I spent much of their childhood “unteaching” them on the way home. 😂
They are both very good men, allies, empathetic. The youngest will be 27 soon. ❤️
In a weird way I am finally old enough to become myself.
Very well presented. A wise Pastor once told us to read everything in the Bible ‘ in context ‘. Read the preceding chapter/ verses to establish the background history and geological history before you start a discussion. I no longer join groups for bible study, I cannot deal with the hate and conceit. It’s useless to try and have a discussion with so-called‘Christian’s’ .
Wendy—I love you so much for this! 💖
You are very much welcome, Julie.
Excellent work as always. It’s the American Taliban.
If Trump actually read the Bible, he would love the phrase "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's" (Matthew (22:21), Mark (12:17), and Luke (20:25). Because he sees himself as Caesar.
If you would like Sharon, after I recover from having written this one, I can cover those , and provide contextually why it is that Christian nationalists often ignore them and/or use other areas of the text to invalidate them.
Go for their jugulars, Wendy! Most of the Christo-nationalists I've encountered, directly or via media, are too damned stupid and ignorant to pass a second-grade reading comprehension test.